Star Wars: Deleted Magic

A forum for creative people.

Re: Star Wars: Deleted Magic

Postby Garrett Gilchrist » Fri Dec 08, 2017 6:52 pm

I am mentioned by name in this RocketJump video essay about how Star Wars was saved in the editing room. I did a popular film in 2005 about how Star Wars was saved in the edit, called Deleted Magic (hence the name of this thread).

http://youtu.be/GFMyMxMYDNk
User avatar
Garrett Gilchrist
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6294
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:23 am

Re: Star Wars: Deleted Magic

Postby Garrett Gilchrist » Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:28 pm

Star Wars: The Last Jedi: Yes, it's good. Rian Johnson, J.J. Abrams and the team behind this new trilogy deserve a lot of credit for what is really wish fulfillment filmmaking. They are giving audiences the sort of Star Wars film that a fan of the original trilogy would make, and that we've wanted to see all these years. Luke Skywalker, Jedi Master, last of his kind? General Leia? Other familiar faces? New adventures that look and feel like the original trilogy did? Oh, it's all here and more.

The Last Jedi takes all the promise that The Force Awakens had and delivers on it. If you enjoyed Daisy Ridley's Rey and Adam Driver's Kylo Ren (Ben Solo), their journey here will be all you wanted and more. Even the trailers didn't lie to you at all. And full credit to the filmmakers for having such faith in their new characters, as John Boyega's Finn and Oscar Isaac's Poe Dameron head off on new adventures - separately, unfortunately. Sorry about that. That's one thing that will disappoint fans.

I can't say I'm as charmed by this newer crew as I was by the original trilogy crew or even some of the prequel characters, but they're fine and the action and excitement of this new installment had the audience laughing, crying, sweating, and on the edge of their seats throughout. It feels like sacrilege to compare this to the original trilogy, which had a magic about it which won't soon be duplicated, but this film goes farther than The Force Awakens did, and this creative team keep on making all the right decisions to make a film that looks and feels like classic Star Wars and will excite and thrill a new generation.

John Williams' familiar themes echo throughout, and so do familiar sights, sounds, and storylines. George Lucas' prequels had a lot more strange new ideas in them, but also largely failed as films. In some ways this is a Star Wars cover band that just plays all the hits, making it look like the original trilogy of films. In other ways it's a series of movies that brings Star Wars alive and kicking into 2017, finally making new films that live up to the legacy and long shadow that the 1977 film began.

The Last Jedi delivers on the promise that The Force Awakens had, and also gives us moments we've been waiting for since 1983. It's a franchise which means a lot to us. The Force is still with the Star Wars franchise, more now than ever.

The credits contain a dedication to the late Carrie Fisher. You may need a moment, as I did, sitting through the rest of those credits, to compose yourself.


ADDENDUM:

I will try to go into more detail about these characters without being hugely spoilery, but this will depend on what you consider to be spoilers. Soft/minor spoilers ahead then.

I was prepared to be disappointed by Luke, but the standout performance here might well be Mark Hamill, who shows us an older Luke Skywalker who has hidden himself away from the world in regret over his past mistakes. We see a lot of sides to Luke here, including flashes of the wide-eyed Luke from the original trilogy, and the powerful Jedi he later became.

When he first read the script for The Last Jedi, Mark Hamill disagreed that Luke would have gone into hiding for years, but it does a good job of filling in the time gap between the original trilogy and this one, darkens Luke's character and connects him to Obi-Wan and Yoda, who did the same. This trilogy is Rey's story, but this film doesn't neglect Luke, who is top billed for his role and who carries the weight of the failure and promise of the Jedi on his back. As with Han Solo in The Force Awakens, we would have gotten a different storyline if these were movies about these characters made in the 80s or 90s, rather than 40 years later (at this point). But here they're coming back after an absence to complete their storylines. That's out of necessity, but it's truthful and it works.

At one point, we also see a side to Leia we haven't seen before, and while we mourn Carrie Fisher and wonder what might have been in episode 9, her final scenes here are quietly poignant and show Leia as the rock holding this team together. As in Rogue One, she represents hope, and leaves on a high note.

More than any other Star Wars film, the cast casually contains a decent number of women in significant roles. Famously, the original trilogy only really had Leia, and one other speaking role for a women per film (Beru, Mon Mothma, and a tech on Hoth). The prequels had Padme and others, and the new films have given us Rey and Jyn Erso, and more.

This film gives us return appearances by Rey, General Leia, Lupita Nyong'o's Maz Kanata, and Gwendoline Christie's Captain Phasma - who never quite manages to remove her helmet.

Billie Lourd, Carrie Fisher's daughter, also has a surprisingly large part, returning as Lieutenant Connix. Then there's Kelly Marie Tran as Rose Tico, a new member of the crew. Rose also has a sister (Veronica Ngo as Paige, I believe). Laura Dern plays Vice Admiral Amilyn Holdo, and there are also lots of minor roles for women throughout.

It's a little peculiar to see recognizable stars like Laura Dern and Benicio Del Toro (as DJ) show up in the Star Wars world (though that's nothing new after the prequels), but they bring a different energy to their roles which is very welcome. DJ might as well have been written for Benicio Del Toro, as the character depends on Del Toro's uniquely vague sense of unpredictable menace. Laura Dern's Holdo is a strong-willed character who clashes with Poe and keeps us guessing. Dern's likeability softens the character quite a bit, and that makes the character work.

Poe and Holdo have constantly clashing ideas, and Poe always wants to go it alone. More to the point Poe always wants to always be right, and he's not -- he's a hothead doing things without approval, his plans competing with and contradicting Holdo and Leia's. He even dresses like Han Solo, and that's why Leia likes him in the first place, though he frustrates her. What's notable in this film is that the women all make the men they're paired with better, in the end. They push them in the right direction. Rey lights a fire under Luke, and even Kylo. Rose pushes Finn to do the right thing, and shows him why she's fighting in the first place, and why they should all be fighting. Holdo and Leia end up teaching Poe that real leadership requires working with others.

I'm already hearing that a lot of guys are uncomfortable because the film is largely about women holding men accountable for their actions and pushing them to grow up.

It's also the part of the Hero's Journey where they burn all the old stuff down so that the important stuff can be reborn. The old king (usually fallen into corruption) always has to die so that the new generation can rise, one way or another. Indeed, unimportant characters who we don't know well (or at all) are sloughed off here in favor of the lead characters, and that's pissing people off but that's exactly how it should be.

Luke has gone into hiding Obi-Wan or Yoda style rather than continue to be a hero, but like those characters he has a reason. Luke has always struggled with his dark side, and is such a "good," "heroic" character that there are things he just won't do, and will hate himself for it. Rey ends up in a place of darkness on Luke's island, a place which broke Ben Solo and which Luke is scared to face. That place turns out to be a mirror - an infinite mirror. It's a repeat of Empire, how Luke went into the cave and found himself. Rey confronts her own legacy, but also has to carry Luke and Ben Solo's.

The film discards a few characters who apparently don't matter in favor of promoting the current main characters. I've seen a lot of complaints about that, even though what this film does is clearly more interesting from a story perspective.

George Lucas' prequels were ahead of their time, and special effects have come a long way since then. There are many obvious examples, including a certain scene with a burning tree which reminds us of the original trilogy, and shows a welcome attention to detail from everyone involved.

Andy Serkis returns as another memorable CGI character, Supreme Leader Snoke. Now that we see him as more of a hologram, he's fulfilling a similar role to Emperor Palpatine from the original and prequel trilogies. While it's always a bit odd to see a CG character in a major part, both Serkis and the effects team pull it off well.

Snoke lives in a red room which looks very much like a movie set. Even that is welcome in a series which has often lacked practical sets. He also has red guards, who take a more active role than the guards in Return of the Jedi, which should delight old-school fans.

There's more than a hint of social commentary as Finn visits a wealthy planet. It's nice to know that a film series about a small group of rebels fighting a giant empire of war hasn't lost its sense of justice. George Lucas' idea of the Empire was very inspired by President Nixon and those who profit from endless war, and that's spelled out clearly here.

Oscar Isaac's Poe Dameron didn't get a lot to do in The Force Awakens but takes a leading role in the Resistance here. The one thing he doesn't get is significant interaction with John Boyega's Finn, despite several scenes together, so we're still waiting to see how that turns out I guess.

Finn remains the impulsive character he was in TFA, ready to jump into battle for the Resistance and escape behind enemy lines. Come to think of it, so does Poe.

We also see enough of C3PO and R2D2 to know that they're very much their old selves. R2 isn't in this much, but gets one very meaningful moment. Meanwhile everyone treats C3PO as if it's still 1980, which is about right.

Domhnall Gleeson's General Hux returns. As with the villains in Rogue One, the actors playing the First Order are clearly having a whale of a time playing the same sort of Nazi-like Imperial bad guys that are so familiar from the original Star Wars trilogy (and Indiana Jones and so on). Gleeson goes further over the top than those actors would have, and it works for this new generation of baddies.

Adam Driver's Kylo Ren might end up being the star of this whole trilogy. As before he's a deep-voiced, murderous bad guy and a serious threat, but also a conflicted and sensitive young man, looking always like he's on the verge of tears, or about to have a temper tantrum. Somehow all this contradiction adds up to a consistent character. The film gets endless mileage out of playing both sides of Kylo Ren (Ben Solo). The conflict inherent to his character is interesting because the film, and the filmmakers, and Driver, are so interested in it. The film lets you care about Kylo/Ben without forgetting that he murdered his father, Han Solo. He gets a shirtless scene which may give fangirls the same conflicted feelings.

Meanwhile Rey continues her journey to becoming a fully-fledged Jedi hero, which Daisy Ridley plays solidly enough. Her scenes with Kylo Ren feel like something that would have been cut out of previous Star Wars films at the script stage, yet it absolutely works here as an exploration of both characters. Like Adam and most of the new crew, Daisy is a better visual actor than a vocal one, but that's fine.

It's a relief that the trailers didn't lie - her journey isn't straightforward in a psychological sense and pushes her into self-discovery and moments of darkness as she struggles to understand the light and dark sides of The Force and become who she needs to be.

The nature of The Force is addressed in this film, taking the Prequels into account but restoring it to how it was described in the 1977 film. The Force, and the Jedi, were described in the first Star Wars film in a spiritual and mythic manner that the prequels didn't live up to, and this film's back to basics approach is a corrective to that, from a fan's point of view, which sets the saga on firmer ground.

Goofy CGI creatures are often used as sight gags, but there's a certain restraint to how the film uses them. The droid BB-8 remains an asset to the team, and the penguin-like Porgs move like practical puppets half the time.

It is still a lot of fun to see something new from this universe. There is less in these new films that is truly "new" but these are classy films, made with respect, and which will keep this saga going for some time.
User avatar
Garrett Gilchrist
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6294
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:23 am

Re: Star Wars: Deleted Magic

Postby Garrett Gilchrist » Tue Dec 12, 2017 10:16 pm

Star Wars: Rogue One writer plugging my 2005 film Star Wars: Deleted Magic.

https://twitter.com/chrisweitz/status/9 ... 8625489920
User avatar
Garrett Gilchrist
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6294
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:23 am

Re: Star Wars: Deleted Magic

Postby Garrett Gilchrist » Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:55 pm

"Detective Poe Dameron, you're a loose cannon!"

"But I get results!"

"You're a hothead, you don't follow orders, and you're gonna get people killed! Turn in your gun and badge, you're off the case!"

"No, you're off the case! The entire Resistance is off the case!"

#StarWars
User avatar
Garrett Gilchrist
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6294
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:23 am

Re: Star Wars: Deleted Magic

Postby Garrett Gilchrist » Sun Dec 17, 2017 6:14 pm

The burning tree scene in #StarWars The Last Jedi, except it's the older Extended Universe novels and comics and etc burning.

Jaxxon the green rabbit, Splinter of the Mind's Eye, Ewok adventures ...

Real page turners, were they?
User avatar
Garrett Gilchrist
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6294
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:23 am

Re: Star Wars: Deleted Magic

Postby Garrett Gilchrist » Sun Dec 17, 2017 7:08 pm

This troll is taking credit for destroying Star Wars The Last Jedi's audience approval score at Rotten Tomatoes.

Reviewers give it 93% fresh but the "audience" score is in the pits due to a few people automating accounts to demolish it.

https://imgur.com/40sIhju
User avatar
Garrett Gilchrist
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6294
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:23 am

Re: Star Wars: Deleted Magic

Postby Garrett Gilchrist » Sun Dec 17, 2017 9:32 pm

Alexi Vandenburg writes: Master Skywalker's answer to Rey that "you don't need Luke Skywalker" is incomplete. They don't need Skywalker to save them, they need Skywalker to inspire them.






They're covered with Star Warsian (Aurabesh?) glyphs in The Last Jedi, but Han's gold dice could be seen in the first Star Wars, briefly. They were "normal" dice onset in SW77 and TFA, judging from a Vanity Fair photo.

http://i.imgur.com/BAB1tBZ.jpg

https://typeset-beta.imgix.net/uploads/ ... eeling.jpg

https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_ ... wars.0.jpg

http://starwarsblog.starwars.com/wp-con ... _100_R.jpg
User avatar
Garrett Gilchrist
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6294
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:23 am

Re: Star Wars: Deleted Magic

Postby Garrett Gilchrist » Mon Dec 18, 2017 7:52 am

Rogue One, and the TV series Star Wars Rebels, set up the idea that the antagonists develop technology to track ships through hyperspace - a plot point in The Last Jedi, set decades later.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DRR90BkUIAEsunk.jpg
User avatar
Garrett Gilchrist
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6294
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:23 am

Re: Star Wars: Deleted Magic

Postby Garrett Gilchrist » Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:40 pm

Collecting some rants for social media use, sorry for spoilers:

Some of the most complained about moments are Leia, Holdo and Rose's biggest hero moments in the film, and I think people don't see that there's a pattern to their complaints.

Also they're mad that it "throws away" stuff from The Force Awakens.

Trying to think if any other Star Wars films have unceremoniously killed off the secondary "main bad guy" and it turns out

almost all of them do.

And would you complain that Vader being Luke's father destroys the existence of a character we hadn't seen and knew nothing about?

That's what people sound like.

The film doesn't do this for no reason. It might be the most thematically rich Star Wars film ever made. It raises the stakes and concentrates on the actual main characters of this new trilogy, rather than characters we'd seen nothing from.

It didn't click with me until later that it was a movie about women trying to get men to grow up. Meanwhile pretty much all the complaints I'm seeing are nonsensical to me and pretty easily rebutted.

Poe's storyline is actually really interesting. The rebels are in a tough situation and there are no easy answers, so he's disagreeing with Holdo but both sides are understandable -- and his failure to follow orders is something he actually needs to grow up from before he gets everyone killed with his impulsiveness -- and most of them die anyway --

It's a big red flag that someone would look at the moment where Leia finally shows us the power she's had all along, and take that as the "ridiculous" moment where they "lose all faith in Star Wars."

I saw someone complaining that having women pilots is "forced diversity."

That the women pilots "looked too young to be there and weren't given much to do. NOT that they were women in general. Big Difference."

Veronica Ngo is 38, but they're too young when they're women?

Shauna Macdonald is 36, I could keep looking this up.

Luke was supposed to be 19.

I've heard Laura Dern, who is 50, comes off as too young for her part.

I mean, you can think it sucks, that's fine, but the old Star Wars having only one woman in it has broken the brain of a whole generation and that's wild. Let Star War have girl in it.

I'm hearing - a lot - that Finn and even Leia should have died, which means people are 100% trash.

And that not finding out the origin story of Snoke ruins the whole trilogy, which is so eyerolling ...

Apparently we need three awful prequels about Snoke's rise to power where Luke rides a lizard and fights a coughing vampire droid with six lightsabers or some shit.

Basically I think the film is going for very deep character themes and it's making people uncomfortable who aren't getting on the film's level and expected something different.

They don't get WHY things are happening and feel it's random and wrong, rather than appreciating what it's doing for the characters.

I bet your fanfiction about what The Last Jedi was "supposed" to be like was a real page turner.

They're also saying that the Rose/Finn storyline is the worst one, which it is. But that's also the Social Commentary bit.

It's also swanky and "rich" looking, which means people think it looks like the prequels, having forgotten what the prequels actually looked like tbh.

This is the part of the hero's journey where you have to let go of the past and make way for something new to be reborn. Luke thinks the world doesn't need Luke Skywalker anymore, but it needs to be inspired by Luke Skywalker, and by the hope of the Resistance.

Literal Neo Nazis are destroying the audience scores because it's got women in it, so every other dork on the internet feels like he can say it's a dumb film rather than thinking about its complex themes for like two minutes.

I know the prequels got us used to Star Wars movies which fall apart if you think about them afterward, but seriously, this one's a keeper.

I saw it a week ago and people are still pointing out big thematic stuff that I'd barely thought about.
User avatar
Garrett Gilchrist
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6294
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:23 am

Re: Star Wars: Deleted Magic

Postby Garrett Gilchrist » Mon Dec 18, 2017 5:23 pm

"What am I supposed to do? Walk up to the entire first order with a laser sword?"

[Timon from the Lion King in a hula outfit]


Nerds are like:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DRXQu2hWAAAChdn.jpg



[Recently-departed, beloved actress and writer who has been everyone's Star Wars favorite for 40 years does something awesome]

nerds: What the fuck is this SJW bullshit



These characters have flaws that they're called out on, and learn from, and grow as people during the course of this film.

One of the legit great things about TLJ is that it goes back to the 1977 definition of The Force, and calls the Jedi, and everyone in the film, out on their failures.

"Pass on what you have learned. Strength, mastery. But weakness, folly, failure also. Yes, failure most of all. The greatest teacher, failure is. Luke, we are what they grow beyond. That is the true burden of all masters."
User avatar
Garrett Gilchrist
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6294
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:23 am

PreviousNext

Return to The Big Round Room

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

cron