The Thief and the Cobbler: Recobbled Cut Mark 4

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Re: The Thief and the Cobbler: Recobbled Cut Mark 4

Postby Garrett Gilchrist » Fri Dec 13, 2013 2:41 pm

The production notes just scanned via Dane Becker credit Princess YumYum to Sara Crowe, and The Mighty One Eye to Chris Greenham, "Britain's tallest man."

http://www.ciaranbrown.com/crowe.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=raTSA6tFLoE

She's a published author with this press:
http://www.transworldbooks.co.uk/contact/contact-us


Dane Becker wrote:
As many of you know, tonight was a special night for The Thief. Doors swung at the Samuel Goldwyn Theater as a packed crowd filled i's room from door to door, to see what was heralded as "the first public screening of Williams' master work".

It was around the same time the curtains opened at the Academy - around 6:30 at night - that I received a call from the Savannah College of Art and Design. Since September, various building entrance-ways and classroom halls were adorned with Thief memorabilia, newspaper clippings, and original drawings. After a "successful framing" of said material, it was ready to be returned to me, along with a 2 gig flash drive of every piece, scanned in extremely high resolution, cropped, cleaned up, and ready to be viewed.

For those that have waited, I appreciate your patience. What was meant to be a one-month job was bogged down by dropped calls, unaligning work schedules, and family tragedies.

But it's done. And it's great.

Enormous thanks, and every bit of credit, goes to Stephen Day. He has been unendingly patient, and I thank him for that. As much as I hate to see them go, your pictures will be back home soon.

And of course, thanks to Garrett Gilchrist. We all hope you had the time of your life.


And here are the first two folders:
https://drive.google.com/folderview?id= ... sp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/folderview?id= ... sp=sharing

A more complete writeup will follow.

The workprint that Richard screened on the 10th contained a few more shots - you've already seen most of these in the Mark 4 Recobbled Cut or the Keramidas cut clips, but there were also finished color clouds in the introduction (which had a roughly animated look about them - I don't think they were on ones), and a more complete scene of Phido attacking Tack in his jail cell - Phido's eye finished in color (as Chris Fern and I had recreated for the Mark 4!) and Tack's two closeups finished as pencil tests. The sound mix to this version was unfortunately missing some important dialogue, music, SFX and audio compared to the familiar workprint, although some scenes had additional sounds.

Ken Cope writes:

I'm feeling a bit too professional. I just had to turn down a colleague's invitation to attend, as his guest, a presentation by Richard Williams of his restored workprint of The Thief and the Cobbler tonight, at Pixar. My students will be turning in their final films and screening them with the other two Animation 1 classes at about the same time.
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Re: The Thief and the Cobbler: Recobbled Cut Mark 4

Postby Hardback247 » Fri Dec 13, 2013 4:30 pm

So, what's to become of Mark 4 now?
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Re: The Thief and the Cobbler: Recobbled Cut Mark 4

Postby PAW » Fri Dec 13, 2013 6:21 pm

Garrett Gilchrist wrote:The production notes just scanned via Dane Becker credit Princess YumYum to Sara Crowe, and The Mighty One Eye to Chris Greenham, "Britain's tallest man."

He's actually credited on the '90 Once brochure. (http://thethief1.blogspot.co.uk/2008/07 ... older.html) But his name's spelt "Greeham" there, no N. Frustrating that we don't know the correct spelling. Pritchard is still credited as Yumyum there, so she must have been recast slightly later.

The workprint that Richard screened on the 10th contained a few more shots - you've already seen most of these in the Mark 4 Recobbled Cut or the Keramidas cut clips, but there were also finished color clouds in the introduction (which had a roughly animated look about them - I don't think they were on ones),

Which section of the clouds was this?
and a more complete scene of Phido attacking Tack in his jail cell - Phido's eye finished in color (as Chris Fern and I had recreated for the Mark 4!) and Tack's two closeups finished as pencil tests. The sound mix to this version was unfortunately missing some important dialogue, music, SFX and audio compared to the familiar workprint, although some scenes had additional sounds.

It''s a shame they didn't add the missing audio back before the screening (if Williams even knew it was missing after this long), although I guess that would have gone against the "moment in time" idea. How much was missing? Which scenes had different sound mixes?
Were there any differences in editing compared to the familiar workprint?
In the scene of Roofless digging up the book and reading from it, were there any pencil tests of the shots that are still storyboards in "our" workprint? (I ask because this was cut from the Keramidas cut, but was in pencil tests in the Calvert work-in-progress; so I was wondering whether it was animated under Williams or not)
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Re: The Thief and the Cobbler: Recobbled Cut Mark 4

Postby Garrett Gilchrist » Fri Dec 13, 2013 6:54 pm

I took notes during the screening. The scene of Roofless starting to dig up the ground at the end of the first scene had a finished pencil test to it rather than the unfinished one we're familiar with, though it's otherwise the same.

It was fun to see the shot of Roofless opening up the book and bugs coming out which was pencil-animated in the more cartoony style from the deleted Brigands scenes. This is also present in our workprint but was very clear on the big screen. I don't recall different pencil tests for the rest; I think it was still all storyboards.

It was a slightly different edit in a few places; the dying soldier battlefield scene had been shortened for a start and some scenes were apparently in the process of being retimed since you'd often see blank screen for a few frames. The different or missing audio may have been intentional at the time but it was pretty odd - Nanny's line "Giant bird! Giant bird!" was absent for example, as was the music during the big pullback from Zigzag's eye through the One Eye camp - replaced with simple drumming. The Brigands dialogue was also absent during the shot of The Thief retrieving a new cloak from the trash. There was a line of blue marker over some shots for unknown editing reasons; the scene of The Thief in Yum Yum's bedroom was rife with it.
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Re: The Thief and the Cobbler: Recobbled Cut Mark 4

Postby mowen4892 » Fri Dec 13, 2013 7:38 pm

The vibe I get from the audio of Dick's introduction (as well as the subtitle "A Moment In Time") is that he doesn't plan to finish the film. I hope this isn't true, because it'd be a great shame to leave this masterpiece in the rough shape that it's in; knowing many animation greats worked on it, knowing there's two butchered versions available in its place, and knowing it would be absolutely astounding if finished. I just find it hard to believe that after everything this film has been through and now that it's starting to get attention again, the film that was slated to be the greatest animated film ever made will never see official release. I hope whatever plans for distribution Kevin Schreck mentioned entail more than just releasing the workprint.
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Re: The Thief and the Cobbler: Recobbled Cut Mark 4

Postby Dennis196492 » Fri Dec 13, 2013 9:41 pm

This is wonderful, I wish I could've been there at the screening.

But I don't think this is the end of Mark IV, or at least I don't want it to be, if there's anything that went overlooked on the Academy restoration like missing audio and dirt from the dupe, I would really like that going through some fan adjustments.

The purpose of the Reccobled Cut may now have change if there's any public release of the Workprint, but even then I wouldn't want to see all that hard work Garret put into restoring what? 40 minutes of the movie? I don't want that to be wasted, especially when it looks gorgeous.

So, I know some scenes are now finished, but what about The Thief in the tighrope? The King attacking Zig Zag? Tack vs The Thief during the climax? Do they look any different than they did on the workprint? Is there stuff from the Calvert WIP that isn't there?
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Re: The Thief and the Cobbler: Recobbled Cut Mark 4

Postby filmfan94 » Fri Dec 13, 2013 9:50 pm

Just to make sure, was Zigzag leaving his tower still in pencil test?
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Re: The Thief and the Cobbler: Recobbled Cut Mark 4

Postby GeoNine » Fri Dec 13, 2013 10:49 pm

I still think the Recobbled cut should be pursued to some degree. Even if Richard Williams has release what he says is a completed workprint, a lot of work has gone into it and more can be done. Now if he officially announces that he's finishing the film, that's a different story. Though unless he actually comes out and says it, I say get it to as complete as you feel it should go. Though now having seen the official workprint, maybe it can give a better idea of what needs to be fixed or where some smaller changes can be made.
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